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sviridovt

Making game harder for larger airlines

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One thing that has become clear to me is that the game becomes too easy once an airline is able to create enough flights/have enough funds. I want the game to still be challenging no matter how big the airline is (I also dont want the whole game to be focused around creating as many routes as possible and instead want to create a game where smarter routes are rewarded more than the amount). @MDK6778, who runs the bug creator airline the GOAT has suggested unions as one idea that I really like. I will look to implement that in 0.2 at the same time as I introduce payroll management. However I'm not sure if its enough and I would like to get suggestions from y'all as it is a hard balance to strike and I want to hear your input. 

 

-Sviri

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Maybe some personnel management, getting good pilots you have to pay more,  payroll staff are needed for large companies otherwise they'll embezel funds, etc...

 

Also potential disaster mechanics, if a plane is used too much increase the percentage chance of a "disaster" event, which would kill/injure/disappear the occupants of a flight, this creates a short term plummet in sales, and a medium term negative modifier on willingness to fly with that airline

 

- jaybee

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Once of the few 'realistic' aspects of AE that I think would be a helpful implementation is on-time flights. This is something which could be gauged on how hard you're pushing your fleet, your staff happiness, union satisfaction, even the airports that you're using and how busy you are and what facilities you have at that airport could all play into this.

 

e.g. using a jetway instead of aircraft stairs may help keep things on-time...but only if your aircraft has built-in stairs. Aircraft without these may actually take a time penalty by not using a jetway...if that all makes sense as an example.

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On 3/29/2019 at 8:16 AM, KJS607 said:

Once of the few 'realistic' aspects of AE that I think would be a helpful implementation is on-time flights. This is something which could be gauged on how hard you're pushing your fleet, your staff happiness, union satisfaction, even the airports that you're using and how busy you are and what facilities you have at that airport could all play into this.

 

e.g. using a jetway instead of aircraft stairs may help keep things on-time...but only if your aircraft has built-in stairs. Aircraft without these may actually take a time penalty by not using a jetway...if that all makes sense as an example.

On-time reputation is coming in 0.2. Jetways vs stairs might be harder to implement but is definitely something that I'm looking to do at a future time.

 

On 3/27/2019 at 5:58 PM, jb567 said:

Maybe some personnel management, getting good pilots you have to pay more,  payroll staff are needed for large companies otherwise they'll embezel funds, etc...

 

Also potential disaster mechanics, if a plane is used too much increase the percentage chance of a "disaster" event, which would kill/injure/disappear the occupants of a flight, this creates a short term plummet in sales, and a medium term negative modifier on willingness to fly with that airline

 

- jaybee

Although I'm not willing to consider disaster mechanics (too much of a can of worms), personnel options are something I'll look to adding in the future. 

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On 4/1/2019 at 4:58 AM, sviridovt said:

Although I'm not willing to consider disaster mechanics (too much of a can of worms), personnel options are something I'll look to adding in the future. 

It does not have to be a disaster, it can be some "issues', that might end up in the grounding of the aircraft type.

Another thing is to try and punish too rapid growth, as seen IRL with airlines that expanded too much and ended up going bust.

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On 4/2/2019 at 9:03 PM, Gibus Airline Group said:

It does not have to be a disaster, it can be some "issues', that might end up in the grounding of the aircraft type.

Another thing is to try and punish too rapid growth, as seen IRL with airlines that expanded too much and ended up going bust.

My concern with punishing rapid growth is in that it would also affect smaller and newer airlines, which is something I don't want since I don't want the game to be slow to begin. 

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1 hour ago, AndrzejSzymanski said:

Maybe add an easy mode?

I can see that being useful, but in my opinion I don't think this is required. I can imagine an "easy world" being made, along with an "infinite world" that I suggested, but this will most likely be added later on.

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A QSI (Quality of Service) model, along with some other industry standard network planning formulas will fix these issues. This will make it so spam can liners will have a low passenger preference compared to a L-1011 in a nice config with 5 star service. (for example). There is a way to balance it out so new airlines don't get hit as hard too.

All the other sims don't have this model in place, you can tell because spam can liners ALWAYS win vs another airline.

If you go down the the path of AirwaySim, and start nerfing the Boeing 757 and other planes because the model is wrong, well that will just make the game too hard. On the contrary, Airline Empires has too loose of a model, where you can  basically create demand in the millions/billions from nothing.

From what I see now, it looks like the implementation of certain formulas will fix it, along with a payload/runway calculator (so I can't fly L-1011s on MDW-LAX anymore), catchment area calculator, hubs/connections and realistic traffic rules. I am sure I will come up with more once I dig into my files further. 

 

Edited by Xx757xx
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I don't know if this exists already, or if it's already planned, but there could be Recession/economic boom periods; maybe based on real events, like market crashes, oil prices rising, or just random events to increase the challenge. That's a good way to make sure the game isn't just about opening routes, players will be forced to make a decision as to which routes to keep.

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1 hour ago, Marcalorian said:

I don't know if this exists already, or if it's already planned, but there could be Recession/economic boom periods; maybe based on real events, like market crashes, oil prices rising, or just random events to increase the challenge. That's a good way to make sure the game isn't just about opening routes, players will be forced to make a decision as to which routes to keep.

This would certainly add a new twist to the game, but can potentially have devastating effects to airlines, especially smaller ones. For example, say a newer and smaller airline based in Country A was mainly flying to Country B, if the event was something affecting Country A and B, then the smaller airline will lose a lot of profits, maybe even forcing them to declare bankruptcy. 

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Maybe It could be a scaling effect; for instance, if you have up to 20 routes, you take a hit of 10-20% of your revenue, but if you have more than that you take 30-50%. 

Also, instead of being a huge event out of nowhere, there could be some warnings before hand, and let the player decide if he wants to continue investing, or save for the rough times ahead.

I should have said that this is a mechanic that already exists in other games, like airtycoon online. There's pre-defined events that trigger the skyrocketing of fuel prices, or market crashes, and there's no way of surviving without re-defining your routes. In fact, it presents an opportunity to smaller companies, because the bigger companies are forced to sell their aircraft, so there's tons of aircraft available at low prices in the used market. That could help with the hardest part of starting you airline, which is building a fleet.

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7 minutes ago, Marcalorian said:

Maybe It could be a scaling effect; for instance, if you have up to 20 routes, you take a hit of 10-20% of your revenue, but if you have more than that you take 30-50%. 

Also, instead of being a huge event out of nowhere, there could be some warnings before hand, and let the player decide if he wants to continue investing, or save for the rough times ahead.

I should have said that this is a mechanic that already exists in other games, like airtycoon online. There's pre-defined events that trigger the skyrocketing of fuel prices, or market crashes, and there's no way of surviving without re-defining your routes. In fact, it presents an opportunity to smaller companies, because the bigger companies are forced to sell their aircraft, so there's tons of aircraft available at low prices in the used market. That could help with the hardest part of starting you airline, which is building a fleet.

actually, interesting Idea, I think that would really work out. A crisis that badly affects large airlines, and benefits small airlines? Interesting...

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You might have noticed that most players are no longer actively playing. If the game is too easy or too fast, you can't retain players who get bored when the game is no longer challenging.

In real world, airlines take about 7 years to earn back the money they spend on buying a brand new aircraft. So if done right, you can only grow to about 16 times the size where you started over the course of 30 years. In the game, it only take 7 days! It is funny to talk about more new features (which makes the game balance even harder to tweak) to improve realism when the basic math is unrealistic ...

The game is currently too easy even for small / new airlines. The hardest part is you have to always remember to change the ticket price after setting up a new route, which some new players fail to realize.

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1 hour ago, IQuit said:

You might have noticed that most players are no longer actively playing. If the game is too easy or too fast, you can't retain players who get bored when the game is no longer challenging.

In real world, airlines take about 7 years to earn back the money they spend on buying a brand new aircraft. So if done right, you can only grow to about 16 times the size where you started over the course of 30 years. In the game, it only take 7 days! It is funny to talk about more new features (which makes the game balance even harder to tweak) to improve realism when the basic math is unrealistic ...

The game is currently too easy even for small / new airlines. The hardest part is you have to always remember to change the ticket price after setting up a new route, which some new players fail to realize.

Personally, I am not playing due to external reasons. Mostly, I don't have the time. Another reason for me is because of the unresponsiveness of the game, I have trouble updating my routes. If that gets fixed, I can come back and hopefully be quicker.

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2 hours ago, IQuit said:

You might have noticed that most players are no longer actively playing. If the game is too easy or too fast, you can't retain players who get bored when the game is no longer challenging.

In real world, airlines take about 7 years to earn back the money they spend on buying a brand new aircraft. So if done right, you can only grow to about 16 times the size where you started over the course of 30 years. In the game, it only take 7 days! It is funny to talk about more new features (which makes the game balance even harder to tweak) to improve realism when the basic math is unrealistic ...

The game is currently too easy even for small / new airlines. The hardest part is you have to always remember to change the ticket price after setting up a new route, which some new players fail to realize.

I mean part of what new features add are new expenses which are currently not modeled correctly. I do agree that finding a balance is a must right now, and it will continue being tweaked and worked on as time progresses. I honestly have just been too busy with school in recent weeks (end of semester) to be too involved in development, but an update is coming. 

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10 hours ago, Gibus Airline Group said:

Another reason for me is because of the unresponsiveness of the game, I have trouble updating my routes.

Yeah, that is the main reason why I am also not playing. There is no point in playing if the only thing making routes does is you losing money on it.

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